HEPB Meeting Scheduled Today On 444 Brickell Archaeological Dig

A presentation to Miami’s Historic and Environmental Preservation Board is scheduled today on the 444 Brickell archaeological dig.

The main architectural finding to date is postholes in the ground, and “one or possibly two circles,” the presentation shows, according to Local10. The postholes represent a foundation of homes, the report said.

Hundreds of archaeologists have been working to excavate the site, with reporting done on a weekly basis to officials.

The HEPB could vote at the meeting on a possible historic designation.

Three towers are planned on the property, rising as tall as 80 stories.

The first tower is already under construction, in an area where there haven’t been any archaeological findings.

Representatives of a neighborhood association, which represents owners who want their views preserved, will also be present at the meeting.

Last week, Jorge Perez, founder of developer Related Group, wrote in the Herald that they intend to proceed to build a “world-class” residential complex on the Miami River in Brickell.

 

The presentation scheduled for today:

 

April HEPB Meeting 040323 by Chris Gothner

 

 

 

 

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Melo is sigma and Chad
7 months ago

Okay add a mini museum at ground level about the finds and lets get these towers up.

Anonymous
7 months ago

No need for that. Proceed as planned.

News4Miami
7 months ago

Update: The Preservation Board saw “an unusually large crowd today.” According to News 10, a final decision has been deferred. The Board requires a management plan and completion of excavation. https://www.local10.com/news/local/2023/04/04/residents-activists-pack-meeting-over-historic-designation-for-brickell-archaeological-site/

Anonymous
7 months ago

Crossing my fingers they don’t cave in to these unjustified demands.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Why? Don’t developers want to see Miami grow into a well planned and worldclass city with more to offer than just condos? The people investing here do… Developer condos will be valued more with landmark attractions… creative solutions to enhance public cultural, historical and recreational spaces in the densest areas.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Later update: The development will move forward on the vacant portion of the land. Two of the three towers will be built there. Preservation status will be given to a small portion on the eastern side of the site (where an office building currently sits), but the developer does not ultimately expect that status to preclude development of third and final tower.

Anonymous
7 months ago

It’s been said previously that the existing office tower (with capital grill at the ground floor) had already destroyed any artifacts when it was originally built about 40 years ago.

Anonymous
7 months ago

The City Board seems to have relied on archeologist opinion that “[Demolition of 444 office] is likely to uncover a rich trove of ancient indigenous artifacts and relics.” Hope the the City was fully informed to ensure integrity of the decision.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Glad developer is not harmed and can build beautiful towers on site! This is a win for the developer and big compromise from the city.

This public notice from the City, eliminates potential future harm and litigation over final third site. The third sites is up for vote later this year for historical designation, around July.

Miami herald reported that the developer suggested there will be an on-site exhibition of all the artifacts, historic features integrated into new construction, a planned riverwalk, and public open spaces.

The third site on Brickell Ave is expected to be even more historical and more connected to Miami Circle. In my opinion it’s ideal visible spot for a large modern museum, visible from the bridge and Brickell Ave. It is great to see the developer committed to creative plans that consider public input and impact on community!

Socretes
7 months ago

Wow. Welcome new guy.
Yes, developers are the ones that have made Miami what it is today. Notice the facts that are so obvious that they should be obvious enough to negate such short-sited comments.
Notice: This specific developer, Jorge Perez, has his name on the Herzog de Meuron Perez Art Museum Miami in Maurice Ferre Park.
Also note, Perez & Co. is also investing in housing school teachers walking distance from the property featured in this article.

Yes. Obviously. Developers know that honestly valuable attractions add to quality of life. Developers also use their eyes and ears to walk one block east of this site to see a underutilized non-artifact. Developers also look at the Met project where they showcased fossils and no one cares.

Something to Inspire Miami 2024
7 months ago

Thank you. As Miami history shows, people have always cared and care even more now. There’s more at stake with less space. Museums downtown are amazing, but cities should have cultural events in every neighborhood.

Not all cultural attractions have been successful but that too can change. We can learn from what went wrong. It doesn’t take a genius to realize that people aren’t impressed by how the history has been presented, or worst, they don’t know it’s even there.

I don’t think we lack the resources here in Miami. This can be a City effort, a people effort, AND a developers effort.

Let’s give those teachers moving into the new housing in Brickell someplace to walk to with their students, rather than just a walled off condo, let’s add something to inspire Miami!

Creative Kind
7 months ago

It’s only a “non artifact” because the city buried it and let all the landscaping die.

There’s so much underutilized land. The city should plant a beautiful garden with light show that brings imagery of the native people to life at night vis holograms or laser light shows, something original and generationally appealing! I’ll even help plant and set you up with the lighting designer for the revival of Istanbuls Basilica Cistern.

There could even be Shakespeare in the round using the circle as a stage.

Life changing experiences like this make he want to visit again and again and spread the word.

A kaleidoscope of colours: Istanbul’s historic Basilica Cistern opens after 5 years. https://m.economictimes.com/magazines/panache/a-kaleidoscope-of-colours-istanbuls-historic-basilica-cistern-opens-after-5-years/amp_articleshow/93218475.cms

Anonymous
7 months ago

I think the site, regardless of its significance should be kept, the project should move forward with whatever modifications needed to accommodate preserving the site. We are living in times of integration and I don’t see why both can’t coexist. Everyone wins, with all the archeological sites in the area it can turn into a really cool attraction, for locals and tourists, field trips for schools, gatherings, etc

Anonymous
7 months ago

Yeah, just like the Miami Circle, they covered up and now it’s a doggie park.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Who is “they” and why? …wasn’t the voters, investors and residents in Brickell and downtown Miami.

Chicago South
7 months ago

Are there any real dog parks in Brickell? Word is everyone is moving there…

Anonymous
7 months ago

…and the resulting development was still another poor design from Arquitectonica.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Don’t forget about MetSquare. Still, I hope something can be worked out that preserves whatever better than Miami Circle or MetSquare, and results in better buildings.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Maybe that’s the “why” it was covered… 🤦‍♀️

Pepita
7 months ago

Is better to have a doggie place that’s us a natural place and not an mounter tower that makes n going to create a caos in the 5 St with all this he traffic that already have

For Rent banners by Melo
7 months ago

Have the first floor dedicated to a museum and science center. Problem solved.

Dan
7 months ago

With a huge open courtyard and cafes along the water for guests and residents to appreciate the cute.

Dan
7 months ago

(appreciate the city)

Anonymous
7 months ago

It’s all or nothing for these NIMBYs.

Anonymous
7 months ago

All would be the entire site. Should the entire site be a Miami landmark and memorial that will make Miami worldclass and boost values and revenue across Miami?

Anonymous
7 months ago

Absolutely the fuck not.

Anonymous
7 months ago

more like boost your Airbnb rental rates you can charge next door while you still have a view

Anonymous
7 months ago

Yeah, Miami’s on the same level as Ft. Wayne unless it builds a museum for those ancient fossilized douches. Fart.

Not Anonymous
7 months ago

Development is great, but I think that in this case, it would be short-sighted to cover u one of Miami’s only important historical structures with a cheap, jagged balcony condo building, especially as this part of Brickell is already very dense and lacks parks. I hope that the city’s heritage is preserved, and the lot is turned into a museum or public space. The City has more than enough money to compensate Related, and revenue from a museum would be a major revenue source of the city.

Anom
7 months ago

Miami to compensate related? No thanks

Anons.
7 months ago

The city should be compensated.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Absolutely no one would visit that museum. It would be such a waste of a perfectly-developable plot. Enough with this garbage. Get the towers in the ground.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Museum’s are not money makers, they lose money and need subsidies to stay open. The county would also lose a large source of property tax revenue if the building is not built.

Anonymous
7 months ago

The City has more than enough money according to you (TAXPAYER money meant for taxpayer services like police, fire, and transit), and should use it to pay off Related so it can take this land to build a “major revenue source” (white elephant money hole) museum. Best to stay Anonymous with this thought.

Anonymous
7 months ago

It’s not a structure that was uncovered. It’s some pottery shards and pointed sticks. Still, if it’s delayed, maybe it’ll force Related back to the drawing board for something more worthy on one of the city’s most valuable and visible pieces of real estate.

NY Transplant
7 months ago

All for towers and museums… but why no public squares, volley ball courts and bike paths on the water like NYC?

Anonymous
7 months ago

You must be new to Miami. The city will sell its soul a thousand times so more “influencers” can move to Brickell.

calivalle
7 months ago

Build the skyscraper with a 30 foot high atrium preserving the ground level

Anonymous
7 months ago

Yes! This would make everyone happy 👏

Anonymous
7 months ago

They made a campfire 7000 years ago. Who cares? Not an important find

Anonymous
7 months ago

Another beaut by the Tequestas.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Best comment 😂😂😂

William
7 months ago

Sincerely hope this project is not stopped because of some shards of pottery.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Exactly. If we let these whiny NIMBYs stop this development, what kind of precedent does this set for the future when more insignificant findings turn up? It’s clearly just a smoke screen for people concerned about their views.

anonchimba
7 months ago

says the transplant 😂

Zz01
7 months ago

Why not put the “findings” inside an existing museum? Why build an entire museum on prime real estate (or modify the plans for existing residential development) just to show off these “findings”. If the findings are so significant, it won’t matter if they are shown in a location on site or somewhere else. The MonaLisa won’t be less special if it’s housed in the Lourve or some other museum.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Errr can the condo be elevated for ground level square… park… stores… restaurants…. cultural center… with glass floor….….

Anonymous
7 months ago

You think people would go see it at HistoryMiami, a cylinder stucco block? People go to the Louvre not just because of what’s inside, but because of the location and architecture of the structure itself.

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Zz01
7 months ago

Then build a better looking museum…. where the existing museum is? You don’t need to build every museum on the exact location of the findings.

Anonymous
7 months ago

HistoryMiami looks like a prison or torture bunker.

Anonymous
7 months ago

I bet the museum doesn’t receive enough donations to sustain itself, promote culture activities for adults, and maintain Miami Circle, based on how it looks outside… is anyone going to buy a postcard of that bland box?

Related does spectacular work and has the taste, style and resources to make something unforgettable that will boost culture in Miami for generations to come and honor Miamis legacy.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Exactly what legacy? Vapid narcissism?

Antennae
7 months ago

Last thing I heard they had encountered important findings.

Melo is sigma and Chad
7 months ago

those are just tiktok videos

Anonymous
7 months ago

It was on local News 10 last night, and National and international news (something Miami should be proud to have on the news.) the artifacts are incredible…

Anonymous
7 months ago

No it wasn’t. The findings were trivial at best.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Nah, everyone was busy covering Alvin Bragg and the Cheatmunck’s kangaroo court.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Is anyone in the neighborhood attending? i heard a large group was going. I’d love to learn about the rare awesome findings.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Say hi to Susan, Linda, Wanda and Betty. They will be there, along with their Pomeranians who are in the market for a new place to take a dump.

anonchimba
7 months ago

more like yolanda, maria, andrea and giselle 😂

Chief Osceola
7 months ago

I’m going just as soon as my shih tzu gets done laying down dookie in front of your condo.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Nah, that’s just propaganda from the Brickell NIMBY’s who oppose any development at all.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Just put the pottery in a museum. Though I wouldn’t mind reconstructing the canoe canals. It’ll make Miami look more like Amsterdam. Lol.

Rocky.
7 months ago

I vote no designation and let’s build all three towers!

Arnold
7 months ago

Vote — built revised plan more open space along the water and glass exhibition area of ancient civilization. Go taller to recoup costs. This will allow density and bring in tourism and create public square and large green park in this dense central area, while preserving culture for our newly redeveloped city.

Anonymous
7 months ago

I actually 100% agree with this

Not Anonymous
7 months ago

You have no regard for the city’s history. It is people like you that have voted to demolish historical buildings in Downtown and replaced them with rental towers and robbed the city of an identity other than the beach and it’s Art deco buildings (Preserved from demolishing themselves, ironic). The city deserves a unique museum or park that benefits more than just developers.

Anonymous
7 months ago

^^the city has had a history museum for decades—only kids on school field trips go there.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Could it be poorly designed, managed and promoted?

Not Anonymous
7 months ago

The key word is “Unique”

Anonymous
7 months ago

it is unique–how many other museums have Miami history in them? You wouldn’t likely know—probably never even been there. I have. Trust me. It’s very unique.

Anonymous
7 months ago

It can be modern and interactive like modern museums… the Miami circle can’t even be seen anymore.

Anonymous
7 months ago

^so previous spending efforts to preserve artifacts did not meet your standards, but this will?

Anonymous
7 months ago

^so you disagree with how they spent tax money on museums in the past, but now it’ll be different and you’ll like it?

Anonymous
7 months ago

You missed the point, entirely.

Anonymous
7 months ago

^there WAS no point

Anan
7 months ago

Which historical buildings in Downtown Miami were demolished ?

Anonymous
7 months ago

Countless hotels along Biscayne Boulevard, some of which are still parking lots or replaced with mediocre condo towers mired in trouble from the start like Vizcayne.

Casey
7 months ago

Hey y’all we can have big parties with DJs at the museum at night like other big cities! Miami needs to step it up.

Enough is Enough
7 months ago

I’m sorry but I am suspicious of a LOT of the supporters of these no build groups. Every post about it on pages like Brickell Living is from people in 500 Brickell or Brickell on the Living who will be directly impacted by it and are latching on to this movement to protect their views or local advocates who just want a nice park on the river. The amount of real, genuine historical support seams small and far between.. I don’t even think some of the native tribes were initially active about this? Even if we did preserve this spot what would it even be? Just look at the Brickell circle park is a glorified dog poop park the city of Miami was forced to pay for and you can’t even tell what’s there! If these findings are SO important, why don’t we just take them over to the circle park DOWN THE STREET and display it there and properly display the artifacts already there?? I have been downvoted before for being against certain developments (that monstrosity on brickell key lol) but I am tired of the fake support for historical preservation that will cost the taxpayers millions just to protect the views of a few and provide another greenspace you have to navigate dog piles in. Collect, analyze, and MOVE ON!

Typo
7 months ago

Brickell on the River* not Brickell on the Living

Anonymous
7 months ago

Brickell needs a large separate dog parks and pocket parks every few blocks. The smell is getting worst but it’s reversible!

Anonymous
7 months ago

Very well said. Their motives are more than clear.

Ricardo
7 months ago

Share your exact same sentiments. Even used the same phrase “glorified dog poop park” earlier this week. Very fortunate dogs we have here in Brickell – the Miami Circle Doggie Pad is one of the most expensive plots of land south of Manhattan… and look what is has become.

Lucy
7 months ago

Miami Circle is not a real dog park, and it’s not maintained at all. It may be severely under funded by the City, and needs our support.

Miami History
7 months ago

Miami Circle is hidden in a corner between the bridge and Icon. People didn’t know about it until now.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Oh you mean people here are too invested in themselves to understand the history right around them? Not Miami! 🙄

Anónimo
7 months ago

Of course you don’t live in Brickell, you only think in money, this contributes to see all the time in the news the problem with mental health … the families are Drowned
Has to deal with a terrible traffic and lose his precious time .
The 5 St is already overcrowded and I don’t want to think how many cars more .
This building are twice bigger than the one already exists.
And u. The same size of the land
It is insane
They don’t respect the death of de American Indians and si respect the human life

Anonymous
7 months ago

Don’t like crowded spaces? Find a new neighborhood!

don shula
7 months ago

this is all about preserving views… to equate post marks on limestone to the great pyramid of giza is such a joke

Anonymous
7 months ago

how’d this go from 5 upvotes to 2 downvotes in like 120 seconds?

Anonymous
7 months ago

someone needs to stop switching isp’s and get a life

Anonymous
7 months ago

Happenens both ways on big topics.

Anonymous
7 months ago

So glad to see the greedy neighbors lost on this.

Mr. Perez
7 months ago

Baccarat – Brickell is moving ahead! Mr. Perez spent over $20million unearthing every indigenous artifact and giving to experts to interpret, preserve, and showcase. What more could one ask from a site developer? It’s more than Miami did when constructing Brickell Ave or the Hyatt / Convention Center the city built across The Miami River

Pepita
7 months ago

He should calculate that this was an historic place, he knows that before any one . the money is important but there are more things that really are important and last for ever, He has a museum, he should know what’s that mean

Anonymous
7 months ago

Yes, Mr. Perez is intelligent to know that there are very important things in the world worth preserving. The pottery shards and shark teeth unearthed below his property do not fit in that category. Thank you Mr. Perez for your forward-thinking and common sense approach to this development.

Anonymous
7 months ago

I have insider information and I have to post this anonymously. Some owners of Brickell on The River have discovered that their building constitution allows short term rentals. So they have started investing heavily in the building to do Airbnb, and they know that losing their views is the end of their business. Now they are advocating for “history to be preserved” because they really care about it….

Anonymous
7 months ago

Even without insider information, that was my outsider’s wildass guess.

Anonymous
7 months ago

again 2 upvotes to 3 downvotes in around 60 seconds….needs investigating. Special interests at work here.

Zz01
7 months ago

That’s not insider information. HOA condominium docs are public record. Anyone that cares enough (or that can afford a decent lawyer) can read and figure out if the docs actually permit short term rentals. And it doesn’t take a sleuth to find out that people with views would stand to lose value if those views are lost and would advocate against the towers.

The article says as much:
“ Representatives of a neighborhood association, which represents owners who want their views preserved, will also be present at the meeting.”

Anonymous
7 months ago

It is insider information because he knows the motive of those people which wasn’t made public before. You seem touchy.

Brickell bay resident
7 months ago

I’m part of BHA and live in Brickell Bay. I live nowhere near the site but have still been very involved in advocacy to preserve this site, as have many others who don’t have any property view interests and are more interested in protecting the cultural heritage. Not everyone who’s been advocating via BHA lives next to the site and has an ulterior motive, although I don’t doubt some are involved in that for that reason since there are residents from those adjacent buildings also involved. But not true to paint the whole organization’s role and involvement as focused on having their views preserved. BHA advocates generally for the quality of life in Brickell.

Anonymous
7 months ago

“Misinformation muddies the waters.” And it’s clear which parties are spreading the misinformation. It’s an Orwellian “up” is “down” sitch (cough cough)

Anonymous
7 months ago

BHA is a useless group of NIMBY’s dedicated to making the neighborhood as sterile and boring as possible. Fuck that group.

Anonymous
7 months ago

What? Thanks for acknowledging this person’s information and telling us that some of those “views losing” residents are the ones behind BHA selfish nimbyism towards this project.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Sorry for your loss! Better luck stopping the next development that blocks their views.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Abby Apé and her Brickell NIMBY group are the worst.

Anonymous
7 months ago

BHA is awesome. She is just one voice of thousands of Brickell owners. BHA gives a voice to many people paying taxes and maintenance fees to keep brickell thriving. I suspect others want more transparency, communication, input, and thoughtful neighborhood planning. Please try to listen and address those concerns in a humane way, since we all want to see Brickell succeed together.

Anonymous
7 months ago

BHA doesn’t represent me, a Brickell homeowner, or any of my friends who own in Brickell.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Add me to that list. I cringe every time I see one of those BHA posts on instagram. Who gave them the right to “represent” Brickell. It’s only NIMBYs full of themselves.

Brickell Anonymous
7 months ago

“Usually, the public comment goes after the presentations. Still, in this case, it went before, preventing Native American activists and the community from responding back to what was said and clearing any misinformation.” – Rosa

Alice in wonderland
7 months ago

I wonder if the people who won’t have their views blocked paid the salaries of the hundreds of archeologists 🤭😜

Anons
7 months ago

Imagine if someone said the Sydney Opera House shouldn’t be built there because it’s prime spot for a condo? Waterfront in a city is prime spot for culture and landmarks.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Totally irrelevant to this discussion but ok.

anonymous
7 months ago

Isn’t this the same as across the street at The Icon Brickell, developed by related as well and they have that park where there were archeological discoveries as well? Do the same thing, build the Baccarat towers and make this area a park; no?

Anonymous
7 months ago

Incredible connected site!

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Howard Roark
7 months ago

I’m certain if a casino was put on this property it would honor their alleged ancestors.

Anonymous but Famous
7 months ago

Reorganize perhaps the parking structure and in part of the lobby raised by columns put in a hurricane glass floor and let the public see the archeologists working in the air conditioned space underneath. The air above the dig has no archeological value.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Lol, all the idiots in the chat simping for a rich developer. Yes, we need yet another hi-rise in Brickell.

Anonymous
7 months ago

We need housing before another Miami Circle/dog waste area. Talk about a huge waste of taxpayer funds.

Pepita
7 months ago

Why he has to built 2 tower twice the number of apartments in the others towers
Equivalent to 4 buildings in the same land
The street is already overcrowded at least 1800 cars in and out, and beside that they don’t respect the important findings from more 7.000 years old
He should make only one tower an live the rest for a museum

Anonymous
7 months ago

The findings already go above and beyond what is required for historic designation. Don’t see how there is any question.

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Alice in wonderland
7 months ago

Since when sharks teeth’s and a graham cracker go above and beyond for historic designation?

Anonymous
7 months ago

lmao

Reasonable
7 months ago

These comments demonstrate why I think a lot of people who genuinely care about this issue are skeptical about building a museum on the ground floor and calling it a day. Mind you, this is exactly what the Met developers proposed – and what they did was incredibly lackluster and did nothing to inform people about the Tequesta tribe, how they lived along the Miami River, and how most were driven from their lands.

If people here are serious about maintaining this development AND respecting the history of the land, then they will advocate for a specific plan that requires the developer to do more than just build some museum on the ground floor. The developer could, for instance, endow a program with a local university to study these artifacts and the Tequesta tribe and understand their contributions to the lands we now live on and how we cannot forget that their lands were stolen from them.

There are many rational, reasonable ways for everyone to get what they want. But it starts with compassion and respect for the importance of remembering those whose lands were stolen from them. None of us could imagine someone stealing our property from us. We can’t change what happened, but we certainly shouldn’t just disregard it and move on as some in this thread suggest.

Anonymous
7 months ago

I believe people were asking in another thread to define what “woke” means. Ladies and gentlemen, here it is.

Reasonable
7 months ago

All I said is that the developer should come up with a serious, meaningful plan to retain what the archaeologists find and ensure that it is properly studied and becomes a part of the fabric of Miami’s history. A ground-floor enclosing of all of the artifacts would be a joke. On the other hand, endowing a program at MDC that studies the Teauesta Indians and makes sense of their history would have a more lasting impact that educates all of us about the city and area we all call home. When the developer gets the green light to continue development, I hope they’ll do something impactful like this.

This is literally a way to memorialize our history and educate ourselves, while allowing the development to move forward. I don’t see what’s “woke” about that – whatever the term means.

Even More Reasonable
7 months ago

“When the developer gets the green light to continue”? Umm they got the green light last week. All 3 towers will be built as planned, thankfully.

Merriam Webster
7 months ago

“woke” means your neighboring condo is losing its views.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Indians had no defined lands, no written claims, no boundaries, and the Indian tribes fought endlessly with each other over land claims. It was a shit show before the white man showed up.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Another beaut by Arquitectonica!

Anonymous
7 months ago

There’s nothing to preserve at this site. Pottery fragment…..bag it and tag it, and go on building. It’s not like this is an ancient Egyptian pyramid, it’s a few broken pisscups from 1250.

Anonymous
7 months ago

Jorge, is that you?